Hey there! We just put together a couple videos that demonstrate looping with our TimeLine delay.
TimeLine Looper Basics
In this first video, we go over the basic looping features available from the front panel. All you need to do is press and hold TAP to enter looper mode, and you can access Record, Overdub, Play, and Stop. All of your delay knobs and parameters are accessible while looping. You can also set the looper to be pre-delay or post-delay. Running the looper pre-delay allows you to record your dry signal and affect the recorded signal with the delay sounds. Routing the looper post-delay will record the delay sounds to the loop. Check it out:
TimeLine Looper MIDI Control
If you want to take your looping a bit further, you can do so by connecting a MIDI controller to your TimeLine. Here we’re using a Voodoo Lab Ground Control Pro, though any MIDI foot controller that can utilize MIDI CC or note messages should work fine. Connecting a MIDI controller will give you access to additional looping features: Reverse, Half Speed, Undo to Initial Loop, Redo, and Looper Pre/Post. In this video, we showcase of these additional features and advanced looping techniques.
Setting up your MIDI controller
You can set up your MIDI controller with either MIDI CC (continuous controller), or MIDI note numbers.
MIDI CC values:
Record – CC# 87, any value
Play – CC# 86, any value
Stop – CC# 85, any value
Reverse (toggle) – CC# 94, any value
Full/Half Speed (toggle) – CC# 95, any value
Pre/Post (toggle) – CC# 96, any value
Undo (to initial loop) – CC# 89, any value
Redo – CC# 90, any value
Looper Level – CC# 98, value range 0-17
Note values:
Record – note 0, velocity > 0
Play – note 2, velocity > 0
Stop – note 4, velocity > 0
Reverse (toggle) – note 14, velocity > 0
Full/Half Speed (toggle) – note 16, velocity > 0
Pre/Post (toggle) – note 17, velocity > 0
Undo (to initial loop) – note 7, velocity > 0
Redo – note 9, velocity > 0
Tags: delay, delay pedal, foot controller, ground control pro, live looping, looper, looping, midi, timeline, voodoo lab
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Pretty amazing gotta say! inspired me to mess around with the looping section alot more!
Awesome demo and tech stuff, but beautiful music too!
One question:
Once you has recorded a loop, what’s happened with the Tap tempo function?
can you change the master tempo via Tap while you’re playback mode?
Thanks
Thanks Dominic!
@Gabriel – In looper mode, the footswitches are dedicated for looper functions, so this means that tap is not available. However, there are a few ways that you can still access tap tempo while looping:
- Set your loop to continue playing when exiting looper mode, which will allow you to access Tap.
- Or, use an external tap tempo pedal or control your tap via MIDI
- Or, use a MIDI controller for looper functions (which doesn’t require entering looper mode). This will leave your Tap switch accessible.
Hope this helps. Thanks! :)
You guys should show a looper + Disaster Area Amps DMC demo as that pairing is incredible small, simple, and incredible.
I use the DMC-4 with no prior midi experience, small footprint, tons of functionality, access to all looper functions and bank/preset scroll, exp features, etc, etc……. all with the ability to cycle through delay in real time. So good!
I was hoping that every preset could store its own midi clock synchronized 30sec loop and you could instantly switch between those loops with midi program changes.
But I understand there is one 30sec looper and you can’t save your loops on each preset?
Is that possible? That would be great.
Hi there, for what you’re looking to do, you may require a dedicated looper pedal that offers more than one loop, loop MIDI sync, etc. Thanks :)
Why don’t you guys make a looper pedal like no other! You can do it!
All of the looper pedals out there are too limiting with time, have awful sound, or not enough features.
Make a solid Looper pedal with long loop times, multi track looping and individual control over the loops like mixing and loop start and timing. Oh by the way, don’t put a bunch of stupid play along loops in it like everyone else does.
Y’know what would be awesome… if the loop would be timestretched on the fly ala Ableton Live, when tap-tempoing quarter notes whilst the loop plays back. That way you could really tighten the loop up with your drummer, all with your feet whilst you play!
When you are looping: can you enter looper mode, record a phrase, stop it, exit looper mode, change a delay setting, enter looper mode again and have the phrase still be there?
I’m wondering how easy it would be to use live, IF you didn’t have the midi control.
Looks like that MIDI CC# chart has a typo. Shows CC# 90 twice for both Redo and Looper Level but the manual says that Looper Level is CC#98. Just fyi….
Ethan, could you share your settings on the video for ‘Meltaway’, ‘Marigold’, and ‘Faux Spring’? Also, when you change time with the double time, does it turn in to quadruple time?
Hi guys – Fantastic video – thanks for sharing!
Quick question – is it possible to disengage the looper from the audio signal, yet is still looping?
(For instance, cutting out the looper, then coming right back into it in all it’s glory).
I believe the El Capistan can do this…
If the timeline does not intrinsically do this, do you have any ideas as to how I could?
Nevermind, I found them all in my presets (…idiot) Thanks!
@Joel – no problem, glad you found the presets! :) You can change between Full Speed and Half Speed— there isn’t any option to quadruple the speed. Thanks
@John – glad you enjoyed the videos!
Not sure I completely understand your question… but when you press Stop the looper stops— it does not continue to silently loop in the background. When you want your loop to come back in, just hit Play. Let me know if that answers your question. :)
Thanks Ethan. OK, it just sounds so choppy and synthy in your demo, I thought you were doubling the time on the initial record, then doubling again on the overdub (when you start tapping twice as fast). I don’t even know if my math makes any sense. My brain hurts thinking about what’s happening. Sounds great though, been trying to replicate it.
Hey Joel— it’s not too difficult. Try just changing the speed back and forth as you record, that’s all I was doing! :)
Hi Ethan! can I synchronize looper and drummachine by midi clock??
Hey there — sorry no the looper can not be synced via midi clock.
thanks for the explanation! hope this feature would be added in future
I’m also interested in the possibility of synching the looper, but not with the midi clock. Others (on TGP) have expressed interest in having the looper seams quantize to the set bpm on the timeline. That way you could sync to loops with known bpm’s. My old looper had this functionality. Really handy. Any chance that might make it in a coming firmware update?
Hi Ethan, I have one question,
Once I record a loop with one delay mode, can i overdub a new loop with another delay mode?
say, first loop with filter delay, second with ice and so on?
Hey Joel— thanks for the info. I can’t guarantee the inclusion of any particular features, but I can let you know that we do consider all customer feedback. Thanks for the suggestion, we will take it into consideration! :)
@Chet – Yes, you can use whatever delay machine you’d like when using the looper. :)
That’s why you guys are aaaaaaaaaawesommmme
I would love a loop manipulation feature to be continuous pitch control as well as pitch-constant time stretching a la SMMH + 16sec delay. Please!!
Off topic, but can you loop and change up the tap tempo at the same time?
Thanks
Is it possible to slow down or speed up a running loop like the el capistan? Or just halfspeed, doublespeed?
Thanks
There is a half speed mode, which is accessible via MIDI.
By default, when you enter looper mode, the Tap Tempo switch becomes the Looper Stop button. There are several ways to tap your tempo while looping. Choose the one that works best for you:
1. Use an external tap switch (plugged into the expression pedal input).
OR
2. Tap in your tempo using an external MIDI controller
OR
3. Set LoopExit to Play in the Globals menu, which will allow the loop to continue to play after exiting looper mode. Once out of looper mode, the tap tempo is again available.
OR
4. Use a MIDI controller for all of your looping functions. All looper functions are available via MIDI without entering looper mode, which means the tap tempo switch is always available.
Soooooo….., how about that librarian editor and firmware update? :)
HEY Ethan!
How come sometimes when I engage the half speed mode during loops the loop actually plays double speed instead of half speed??
@Alan – that is because you started the loop while the machine was already in half speed mode! :)
@Joel – there were some bumps in the road regarding the librarian— we should have more info on this early next week. Thanks very much for your patience.
Hi! I’m trying to use my volume pedal on my Ground Control Pro exactly like you have in the video. I can’t get my volume/expression pedal to control the right parameters. It’s “working,” but I can’t seem to find out how you guys were able to control the volume level of the loop. Thx!
Note: I realize this is a Ground Control Issue, but I can’t find any info online. Thx!
Got it figured out now. BUT, the volume coming out of the “recorded” loop is almost TWICE as loud as the original signal Im putting into it? Trying to figure out how to plug these values 0-17 in somewhere. Thx!
@Derek – For that particular MIDI CC, the Ground Control is likely defaulting to a value higher than 17. That’s why the loop plays back louder than your input signal. As you know, our values for the Looper Level MIDI CC are 0-17, so anything over that will result in a louder (or even distorted loop). It’s been a while, so I don’t remember exactly how to set up an expression pedal for the Ground Control. However here’s a pretty good video that discusses doing just that—their application is with the ElevenRack, though the main principles should still apply: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IJv4lua2Zs
Hope this helps!
so… how’s that librarian coming?
@Joel – we have some news on the librarian project here: http://www.strymon.net/2012/12/14/preset-librarian-going-open-platform/
Thanks.
Question: When I have a loop going (either controlled by a DMC 3xl, or with LPEXIT set to “play”), turning OFF the ‘A’ preset effect will stop the loop. This doesn’t happen when turning OFF ‘B’. Any idea why? I can also create a loop with no effect engaged as long as I am on the ‘B’ (turned off), but starting with the ‘A’ turned off, nothing will loop.
I’ve tried every combination of situations I can think of, and ‘A’ OFF always kills the loop. For instance, with LPEXIT set to STOP, I can be in looper mode (with any preset A, B, or B off) and create a loop. Leaving looper mode of course stops the loop. Then I can do all sorts of other things and go back to looper and hit play and it will still be there, EXCEPT if I have ‘A’ turned off.
Hi Don, this is due to using True Bypass. If you want any processed audio (delay trails, loops) to continue after you’ve bypassed, you need to use Buffered Bypass, since True Bypass is inherently a mechanical bypass.
Most likely your TimeLine is set to True Bypass and your ‘A’ preset has Delay Persist set to Off. Your ‘B’ preset has Delay Persist set to On, which utilizes a Buffered Bypass for that preset only.
If you don’t ever want True Bypass, just go to your Globals menu and set BYPASS to BUFBYP. Alternatively, on the parameters for your ‘A’ preset, set PRSIST to ON, and save the preset. This FAQ should help:
http://www.strymon.net/support/faqs/how-do-i-record-to-the-timeline-looper-while-bypassed
Thanks Ethan. Of course, that makes total sense! I think it was a fluke that all the A presets I used when checked this had Persist off, and all the B’s had it on. Made me think there was something else going on with the A side of things. I’ve got it working now with the BUFBYP.
Hi,
I don´t know why assign a range value 0 – 17 with looper volume? Is more easy assign 0 – 127, because isn’t operative. The normal pedal expresion midi is 0- 127
Hey there,
Any chance there will be a “play once” feature or “one shot” included in any of the future firmware updates? (if one exists and I’ve overlooked it, please let me know where to find it)
***Side note… Kinda.
Curious if it would ever be possible to expand upon the expression input, using it as a AUX input similar to the way eventides timefactor had, but being able to choose between the exp/tap/aux (first 2 already current in globals)
I understand why this wouldn’t be possible if it were a hardware issue, but I would really love to add a few more “instant access” buttons to my earlier Digital Music Corp ground control (v2.3) as I’ve only got 6 across the top row (LtoR: rec/dub, play, stop, repeats, bypass, tap)
I’m able to quickly change repeats (CC97 I believe) over to reverse if needed (not live… for examples only ) but I could really use more instant access actions (ie, undo, redo, half speed)
Ethan- do you have any idea if a aux fs (such as the digitech FS-300) could work with the ground control? (ie- exp out to expand?…)
Cheers
@Iorio – we wanted the range to give the ability to go a bit louder with the loop volume if you wanted. Try setting the top value to 19 or 20 and it will give you a boost in the volume at the top end of the expression pedal.
@Michael – there isn’t a Play Once feature. The way to go would be to just hit Stop when the loop is done. You can re-trigger the loop by just pressing Play again— each press will re-trigger the loop from the start, which can be useful if you need to sync with a live band.
No plans to add any additional features to the Expression input other than external Tap and expression pedal at this point… While I can’t guarantee that new features will be added, we do listen to and consider all customer feedback and suggestions. There are MIDI controllers out there that offer multiple banks for those who need a ton of MIDI control.
Not sure about the Digitech pedal working with the Ground Control—definitely contact Voodoo Lab, they will definitely help you out on that! :)
Hey there. Ive ordered my timeline and cant wait to get it. My question might be simple,but anyways… if i connect the timeline in the effects loop of my badger 35 ,(via a suhr minimix II) will i be able to use the looper? because i would have to set my pedal in “kill” in the dry mode option… if any i will also try it in front of the amp but my goal would be to have in the effects loop.
Thanks again
E
Has anyone used an IPad as a midi controller? If so what app/hardware?
Is the firmware update still happening end of the month?
Hi Joel, we’re shooting for early next week. Thanks!
Yes!
are MIDI functions (reverse etc.) available without controller? if yes, how easy?
hi guys
i’m so near to buy Timeline, the answer to my question will not affect the purchase so jump to the quesion.
There is a way to sync looper to a known BPM? i’n not interested to midi sync but i play with drum machines and i’d like the loop will not de-sync after 3 or three loops.
@acaonweb, there is no way to quantize or sync up the looper on TimeLine to a known BPM.
If there’s no current way to sync looper to external clock, can we expect an enhanced model at some point that might? That would be pretty tasty…
Hey Jason— thanks for the suggestion. We can’t guarantee the development of specific products or features but we do listen to and consider all customer suggestions. Thanks!!
I agree that the looper should be auto quantizable to a 1/4, 1/8 or 1/16 note. Its hard to have perfect time with the looper every time when you are playing with someone else. I frequently find myself having to manually trigger the loop to keep really tight timing. This is not good for long jams.
Hi tenkai, thanks for the suggestion. Quantization is a feature usually reserved for dedicated loopers, there are a few out there that quantize. We can’t guarantee the development of this specific feature but we do consider all customer suggestions. Thanks!